White and Black magic.

A little harshly worded perhaps, but this statement leads me to an interesting question.
What are your opinions on the idea of white/black magic? What is the difference? How should each one be defined? Is there any difference at all?

Continuing on from the above quote, LaVey goes on to say that so-called “White” magic is traditionally considered to be performed for benevolent, selfless purposes while “Black” magic is used for self-aggrandizement and personal power. He then suggests that,

‘No one on earth ever pursued occult studies… or any other “white light” concept, without ego gratification or personal power as a goal.’

If this is true, then surely either all magic must be considered “black” because it all includes at least some hint of, as he put it, ‘ego gratification’ (even the most selfless spells, workings etc produce that warm and fuzzy feeling that you’ve done a good deed!), or differentiating between the terms “white” and “black” magic is completely pointless.


What do you guys think?

Personally i dont consider magic black or white. To me the outcome of magic depends on the intend of the user. If your setting out to do something bad then it'll be bad, same with doing something good.
Like any tool it is the actions of the user themselves that dictates the outcome.

Whenever i hear someone declare themself a 'white witch' or a 'practitioner of black magic' i tend to approach with caution as most of the time i feel it is mostly about ego.
' You'd best watch your back, one wrong move and i curse you'. 'Oh look at me and how pure i am.' Ooooooo, i'm scared/in awe.

In my opinion to aim for one or the other only throws your balance out, and magic to me is an element which needs to be in balance lest you throw yourself into an out of control spiral. As my close friends know i often say i'm 'basking in the grey' as i believe staying balanced is my mian priority and trying to be perfect just isn't what i'd consider an attainable goal, or very human. I am human and i accept my failings and mistakes so why should magic be any different?

‘There is no difference between “White” and “Black” magic, except in the smug hypocrisy, guilt-ridden, righteousness, and self-deceit of the “White” magician himself.’ – Anton LaVey

In a two words Ignorant Muppet!

There is a HUGE difference its called INTENT

I firmly believe that magick is neither black nor white it is the intent of the caster which determines 'Good' or 'Bad'. However i would point out we are talking proper witches/casters here and not stage magicians.

I would also say to that quote hmmm yeh no such thing as a good or bad christian right? sorry but i have known christians/catholics/jehovas witnesses and people from ALL different religions some are REAL nice people and true sweethearts, others are the most nasty, self absorbed hypocrites to walk the planet, therefore i state:

If magick is used with the intention to harm then it is upon the CASTER and NOT the magick

Wow, Tia is very enraged at this one! Not a LaVey fan i take it?

It's interesting you both talk about intent. Carrying on from that quote, he says the reason magic can't be defined as white or black is because a persons intent can't be defined as white or black/good or evil, it's completely subjective.
There's not a universal acceptance of whats right or wrong. He says "what's pleasure to one is pain to another and the same applies to good and evil."

Personally i think this is true. And so surely that makes labeling someone "good" or "bad" impossible. They're "bad" by your standards and opinions, that doesn't mean they're bad.

Thoughts?

This is a very interesting subject and one that does tend to get my hackles up, mainly because of the small mindedness of some of the human race who use religion and beliefs as an excuse to be shitty to each other. I lost count of the amount of times i been told i am 'evil' simply because i am a witch *shakes head*

For some reason its perfectly acceptable to rob ya grannie of her life savings as long as your a christian and go to church after to say sorry because god will forgive you.

But if your a witch apparently he isnt that tolerant

This is where i waffle some......the Wiccan rede states 'An it harm none' ........soooooo what do we class as harm?

Like Bram asks whose yardstick are we using to define good and bad?

Example: A man attacks a young woman and hurts her badly however there is little the law can do as he claims to have an alibi and indeed someone provides him with one.

Said young woman or someone on her behalf casts a spell to bring the attacker to 'justice'. This spell could indeed have negative consequenses for the alibi provider, after all, they DID pervert the course of justice for whatever reason be it love or genuinely believe their friend/partner couldnt do something like that, and end up either on probabtion or in jail for protecting their friend/lover. It also brings the attacker to justice and he gets sentanced to time in prison.

So where in this is the good and the bad? Who decides?